A Group of Theologians on Amoris Laetitia and CMTV

A Group of Theologians on Amoris Laetitia and CMTV - Updated

JMJ

Retirement is so much fun!!!

The appeal to Cardinal Sodano (see Rorate) has caused a bit of a stir across the spectrum of Catholicism.

Interestingly, it didn't hit the front page over at CMTV - I had to dig into the daily news briefing to click on this link which lead to Edward Pentin's piece. I had expected some sort of commentary - but after announcing the document - just crickets.

I will reiterate my belief that while WE do not know the identity of the signatories to the document - beyond Professor Shaw - We do know there are signatories.

This is very interesting as, aside from the group of theologians who intervened in the case of the Novus Ordo Missae, I am not aware of anyone calling out the Pope on a document with theological censures since John XXII.

Pray that the Pope listens and supports the Teaching of the Church!!!

P^3

Update

Hilary White's opinion was that the signatories behind the intervention are cowards.

Here's Dr. Shaw's and Dr. Lamont's responses:

Thank you, Hillary.
But I don’t want to claim any greater degree of machismo than the other signatories of the appeal. The point of the document is not a public denunciation but a private appeal to the Cardinals and Patriarchs. The reason we’ve issued a press release is to prevent it being misrepresented (or, at least, to make that a little harder).
If the appeal has any positive effect the push-back will almost certainly include a leaking of the text and signatories and a persecution of the latter. I am in an unusally secure position. Many of the other signatories will need your prayers. ( http://whatisupwiththesynod.com/index.php/2016/07/12/on-growing-a-pair/#comment-5531 )
...
As a matter of fact I wouldn’t say the lay signatories are more worried than the clerical ones. The latter have religious superiors and bishops to worry about, and vows of obedience. They too may find it impossible to feed their children – their spiritual ones – when the chickens come home to roost. They’ve all made the calculation and understand the risk. ( http://whatisupwiththesynod.com/index.php/2016/07/12/on-growing-a-pair/#comment-5554 )

Dear Hilary,
I don’t think the accusation of cowardice and anonymity stands up, as the identity of the signatories of the document is known to all of the college of cardinals and Eastern patriarchs. They will thus be known at once to the ecclesiastical powers who will have an interest in punishing them for this initiative, and it can be expected that this punishment will be forthcoming – as the signatories are well aware. (I will mention that I am one of the signatories myself.) The names of the signatories have not been publicly announced because the appeal is to the college of cardinals and to the patriarchs, rather than to the general Catholic public. That is because it is the college of cardinals and the patriarchs that have the first responsibility to take steps in approaching (and reproaching) the pope on Amoris Laetitia. In legal and ecclesiastical terms, they have the right to be the first recipients of any protest and request for action about the errors of that document. If they carry out their responsibilities, there will be no need for the signatories to address Catholics generally about the errors of Amoris Laetitia, because the college of cardinals will do so on their behalf, with greater authority. You are no doubt skeptical about the possibility of this happening, and I would not argue with you about that. But the people at the top have to at least be given a chance to do their job and carry out their responsibilities. It is a matter of respect for their office and its authority – which is respect for the Church herself – regardless of the actual character of the officeholders. Showing this respect provides some protection against retaliation for the signatories, which is another reason for addressing ecclesiastical authority rather than the general public in the first place; but it is justified on its own terms. If the ecclesiastical authorities fail in this regard, then a broader appeal to Catholics can become justified and necessary. At the same time it is important for Catholics generally to know that someone is trying to do something about the errors of Amoris Laetitia and the harm these errors are causing. One may anticipate as well that the supporters of these errors will try to misrepresent the appeal in order to discredit it. It thus becomes desirable to clarify its nature at the outset. Hence the press release, which is not a final statement on the whole affair.
John Lamont ( http://whatisupwiththesynod.com/index.php/2016/07/12/on-growing-a-pair/#comment-5597 )

Auctorem Fidei

Can the SSPX be right about the Novus Ordo? Revision: Feb 11, 2013 On another web forum, I was engaged in a rather heated discussion about the documents of Vatican II.

Is it sinful to attend the Novus Ordo (New Mass) - Is it Sinful to Not Attend the Novus Ordo on Sunday?

+ JMJ A non-SSPX Catholic is upset over the SSPX statements on not attending the Novus Ordo Missae. Ladies and gentlemen, what the SSPX, or at least its website editor, is advocating is a mortal sin against the Third Commandment. Unless the priest deviates from the language of the Sacramentary, the consecration, and thus the rest of Mass is to be considered valid. No one may elect not to attend Mass simply because abuses are occurring therein. Might I suggest that such absenteeism is its own abuse? The Third Commandment binds under mortal sin. Father So-And-So from the SSPX has no authority whatsoever to excuse attendance at Mass, be that Mass ever so unpalatable. Source:Restore DC Catholicism Well, this is interesting. First why does the SSPX issue this statement? Because it is sinful to put your faith in danger by attending a protestant service. It is likewise dangerous to put your faith in danger by attending a protestantized mass (ie the Novus Ordo Missae

Morning and Evening and other sundry Prayers

+ JMJ Along the theme of P^3 (Prayer, Penance, Patience), and for my own reference ... here is a collection of Morning and Evening prayers from the Ideal Daily Missal along with some additional prayers. In this crisis of the Church, I do not think it is possible to do too much prayer, penance and have patience. P^3

Catholic Culture - The Edgar Schein Model Analysis of the Pre and Post Conciliar Culture

+ JMJ So ... I was thinking ... I've used Edgar Schein's (RIP) organizational cultural model (link ) in my research ... why not apply it in a comparison between the Catholic Organizational Culture - PRE and POST Second Vatican Culture? Of course, this will be from my own perspective, I'm certain that others will think differently. 😁 Also, apologies for a rather long article. Graphic: https://mutomorro.com/edgar-scheins-culture-model/ Below is a quick mapping of the cultural factors that I could think of. Since the Church is vast and composed of millions of Souls, it is necessarily a limited cultural map. Yet, I think it will still be useful to assess what has changed since the Second Vatican Council. Additional Reading: 5 enduring management ideas from MIT Sloan’s Edgar Schein | MIT Sloan Artifacts Artifacts are tangible and observable aspects of the culture being examined. All organizations have them. Walmart has their Walmart chant, Charismatics have their spe

Holy Ghost vs Holy Spirit

+ JMJ Something that always and I do mean always causes me to cringe interiourly is when non-Trad Catholics use the words "Holy Spirit" instead of "Holy Ghost". First, this is a natural response because of long usage of "Holy Ghost" as soon as I hear the word "Holy" in a prayer, my brain automatically is prepped to hear "Ghost" afterwards. This creates a short period of interiour dissonance (discomfort). Now the question I would like to ponder today is whether or not there is a difference and whether or not there is a right way vs wrong way.

Tradicat

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