Skip to main content

Re Blog: Yes Sally, Pope Francis IS the Pope and is in great need of our prayers!

Image
By
+
JMJ

As a Traditional Catholic I find it ironic that I'm usually the one talking Modern Catholics off the sedevacantist ledge.

Recently, Louie Verrecchio has posted an article by a Fr. Campo, that is asserting that the abdication was forced and therefore invalid ... of something to that effect.

Sadly, the electrons spilled over this issue are in vain.

Here's a quick summary of the doctrine on Dogmatic Facts:

Now the point is this:
We want to believe that Pope Francis is not the Pope, because he is doing such a bad job.

However, we know that he is because of the doctrine of dogmatic facts.

Any action that we 'believe' that would invalidate the election is proved wrong by the acceptance of a newly elected Pope by all the Bishops and by extension the whole Catholic Church.

Pope Francis was accepted by the Bishops in Union with Rome, ergo - we have the assurance of the doctrine that he was validly elected.



P^3

PS.Now if the Church should determine that Pope Francis was invalidly elected, they will have to amend the doctrine of Dogmatic Facts as it pertains to the election of a Pope.

But until that hypothetical even occurs - we have the rely upon the present document.



Re Blogged  from Tradicat

The Church of Christ is Apostolic and this is also a 'Mark' of the Church.

Specifically it means: 
The true Church is also to be recognised from her origin, which can be traced back under the law of grace to the Apostles; for her doctrine is the truth not recently given, nor now first heard of, but delivered of old by the Apostles, and disseminated throughout the entire world. ... That all, therefore, might know which was the Catholic Church, the Fathers, guided by the Spirit of God, added to the Creed the word Apostolic. For the Holy Ghost, who presides over the Church, governs her by no other ministers than those of Apostolic succession.  (Tradicat: Marks of the Church Apostolic - Catechism of Trent)
The consequence of this is Dogma is that if there are no longer any Bishops, then the promise of Our Lord Jesus Christ that the Church would stand to the end of the world, was false. A secondary consequence of this would be the eradication of the priesthood.  Closely related to this Dogma is that defined during the First Vatican Council. Namely, that there will be successors of St. Peter until the end of the world.



The Church in Her wisdom has taken safeguards to ensure that the Apostolic Succession is not lost, specifically by normally having three bishops perform the consecration of a new bishop.  Having a consecrator and two co-consecrators ensures that if there is a defect in one, then the other two will supply.

This question is sometimes raised regarding the validity of Archbishop Lefebvre's own episcopal consecration as there were rumours that Cardinal Leinart was a free mason.

The first response is that there were no doubts of the co-consecrators. The second is that the rumours have never been proved. Lastly, the form was followed in the consecration and therefore, barring any authoritative investigation, the principle of the Church is to assume that when the form is followed the sacrament is conveyed.

A similar question is raised concerning Pope St. John XXIII and Pope Paul VI: If they were masons, then they weren't Pope etc.

This question is answered if one adheres to the doctrine (lower case) of the Church on this matter.

Specifically, it is a universally held theological conclusion that if the Bishops of the Church accept a newly elected Bishop as the Pope, then any perceived impediments were not real.  This is classified as an infallible dogmatic fact ( Dogmatic Fact or Fancy ).

Caveat, the sede-vacantists that I have encountered throw up lots of excuses to re-imagine this simple doctrine.  So if you cast about the internet you will find opinions that run counter to this doctrine. However, I would advise you to take the words of the Church as the Church has understood them and expressed by the theologians of the Church in a consistent and universal manner.
P^3

Labels

Labels:

Comments

Post a Comment

Popular posts from this blog

SSPX and the Resistance - A Comparison Of Ecclesiology

By
Shining the light of Church Teaching on the doctrinal positions of the SSPX and the Resistance. Principles are guides used to aid in decision making.  It stands to reason that bad principles will lead to bad decisions. The recent interactions between Rome and the SSPX has challenged a number of closely held cultural assumptions of people in both sides of the disagreement. This has resulted in cultural skirmishes in both Rome and the SSPX. Since it is the smaller of the two, the skirmishes have been more evident within the SSPX.  The cultural fault-line that Bishop Fellay crossed appears to be linked to two points of Catholic Doctrine: Ecclesiology and Obedience.  The cultural difference of view points is strong enough that it has resulted in the expulsion of a number of members.  It should also be noted that some other priests expelled since the beginning of the latest interactions (starting in 2000) held the same view points and have joined with the l...
8 comments
Read more

Morning and Evening and other sundry Prayers

By
+ JMJ Along the theme of P^3 (Prayer, Penance, Patience), and for my own reference ... here is a collection of Morning and Evening prayers from the Ideal Daily Missal along with some additional prayers. In this crisis of the Church, I do not think it is possible to do too much prayer, penance and have patience. P^3
Post a Comment
Read more

Church Militant TV and the SSPX - Again

By
+ JMJ The old narrative used to be that the SSPX was 'schismatic' and 'excommunicated'. Now the excommunication has been lifted for a number of years and the only ones who think it still has effect are the 'resistors'. That leaves the other opponents of the SSPX with the label 'schismatic'. Make it clear, the conservative Catholics have issues with the SSPX probably because they violate some of their assumptions about the Faith and this crisis of the Church. Church Militant TV is one of these the exists along the Catholic thought spectrum. They like the Traditional Mass but must ensure that they don't get tarred with the same 'schismatic' brush that the liberals use against the SSPX.  So what do they do, they use the same brush against the SSPX. The funny thing is that even when the Church does speak, they don't want to listen and persist in calling the SSPX 'schismatic'. Here's a transcript of the latest s...
Post a Comment
Read more

The Curious Case of Steve Skojec and the Dangers of Deep Diving into the Crisis Sub-Titled: The Failings of Others

By
 + JMJ It's been a while now since Steve Skojec sold 1P5 and abandoned the Catholic Faith. I've been a 'Trad' since 1982 and in those 40+ years I seen this death-spiral before with a similar end point. It seems that anyone who jumps into the fray unprepared for the enormous task of righting wrongs will, eventually, become discouraged by not the task but the people who surround them.   I remember when Skojec complained of the treatment his family received from a traditional priest.  This seems to have been the start of the end for him. So what can we learn from the likes of Steve Skojec, Michael Voris (maybe?), Louie Verrecchio, Gerry Matatix and other celebrity Catholics? Probably quite a lot about what not to do. First, don't burn out on the crisis?  When you burn out, on work or anything else, little things assume a more greater importance than they are due.   This is one of my 'canary in the coal mine' signals that I've been stretching myself too th...
Post a Comment
Read more

The Position of the SSPX on Canonizations by the Saint Factory

By
+ JMJ I have sometimes been criticized for including 'St' as a title for Pope John Paul II et al. I've given my reasons here  in a discussion with Alex Long. The question is one of prudence in discussions with ntCatholics and in some cases with tCatholics. In discussions with:  ntCatholics, I will use the title in order to continue the discussion and help them arrive at a realistic understanding of the crisis of the Church. tCatholics, I will use the title in order to broaden their perspective on the doctrine of dogmatic facts. This broader perspective is, in my opinion, essential maintaining a realistic understanding of the crisis of the Church. So from a doctrinal position, I have written the article Dogmatic Fact of Fancy  and includes a reference on canonizations. Now, I know the position of the SSPX is that the canonizations are doubtful (see references below) and I also know of at least one non-SSPX theologian who agrees with the level of doubt du...
Post a Comment
Read more