Universal Salvation and Bl. Pope John Paul II

JMJ

While following the comings and goings in the blogosphere (ie following the blogs that I link - but abstaining from commenting), I came across a couple of articles that I believe require some commentary - but not because of the contents but the references.

I was reading the Remnant's latest online article and noticed the following reference:

Eternal damnation remains a possibility, but we are not granted, without special divine revelation, the knowledge of whether or which human beings are effectively involved in it.

I found the same reference in another article in reply to the 'radtrad' accusations by various online personalities.

I have read this particular phrase many times, linked with the assertion that Pope John Paul II believed in Universal Salvation.

Today I decided to follow the reference to explore the context. That was when I discovered that the online version of the text did not agree with that quoted above.

Instead it read:

Damnation remains a real possibility, but it is not granted to us, without special divine revelation, to know which human beings are effectively involved in it.

Needless to say, I was stunned that the Remnant could have made such an error.

As I dug further (google was invaluable) I discovered that there are two versions of the text of the 28 July 1999 audience on the Vatican website. One that is accessed via the main vatican.va website by navigating to the audiences of Bl. Pope John Paul II.The other which appears in some searches with the correct keywords.

It is the latter version that agrees with the quotations provided by the 'radtrads' of the Remnant, SSPX etc.

Version 1

Eternal damnation remains a real possibility, but we are not granted, without special divine revelation, the knowledge of whether or which human beings are effectively involved in it.
http://www.vatican.va/holy_father/john_paul_ii/audiences/documents/hf_jp-ii_aud_28071999_en.html

La dannazione rimane una reale possibilità, ma non ci è dato di conoscere, senza speciale rivelazione divina, se e quali esseri umani vi siano effettivamente coinvolti.
http://www.vatican.va/holy_father/john_paul_ii/audiences/documents/hf_jp-ii_aud_28071999_it.htm

Version 2

Damnation remains a real possibility, but it is not granted to us, without special divine revelation, to know which human beings are effectively involved in it.
http://www.vatican.va/holy_father/john_paul_ii/audiences/1999/documents/hf_jp-ii_aud_28071999_en.html

La dannazione rimane una reale possibilità, ma non ci è dato di conoscere, senza speciale rivelazione divina, quali esseri umani vi siano effettivamente coinvolti.
http://www.vatican.va/holy_father/john_paul_ii/audiences/1999/documents/hf_jp-ii_aud_28071999_it.html

When I noticed the difference, I was reminded that history is written by the victor.

I am confident that the conspiracy minded will launch into orbit over this 'discovery' drawing conclusions that are not supported by the evidence.

What we do know is that there is a difference between the two translations.

The question that needs to be answered is whether or not it is merely a correction to bring the words into line with what Pope John Paul II actually said, or is it an attempt to scrub something from his record.

There is no point in arguing the issue. All that is required is to produce a recording of the audience, which I assume was given in Italian, and verify the actual words.

Perhaps someone will be able to do such a service in the near future.

Wishing you a Holy and Happy Lent!

Tradical
P^3

The Curious Case of Steve Skojec and the Dangers of Deep Diving into the Crisis Sub-Titled: The Failings of Others

+ JMJ It's been a while now since Steve Skojec sold 1P5 and abandoned the Catholic Faith. I've been a 'Trad' since 1982 and in those 40+ years I seen this death-spiral before with a similar end point. It seems that anyone who jumps into the fray unprepared for the enormous task of righting wrongs will, eventually, become discouraged by not the task but the people who surround them. I remember when Skojec complained of the treatment his family received from a traditional priest. This seems to have been the start of the end for him. So what can we learn from the likes of Steve Skojec, Michael Voris (maybe?), Louie Verrecchio, Gerry Matatix and other celebrity Catholics? Probably quite a lot about what not to do. First, don't burn out on the crisis? When you burn out, on work or anything else, little things assume a more greater importance than they are due. This is one of my 'canary in the coal mine' signals that I've been stretching myself too th...

Communique about Avrille Dominicans - SSPX.org

+ JMJ Having completed the review of the 'Avrille' perspective, this communique from the French District Superior is perfectly timed. I believe that the 'resistance' has lost rationality and further argumentation simply results in their holding on to their false ideal all the more firmly. Pray much ... First, for them to acquiesce to the grace of humility in order to obtain a clear perspective on the principles involved. Second, that we may remain faithful to the Church, and Her Dogmas, Doctrines and Principles. Lest we become that which against we strove ... P^3 Courtesy of SSPX.org

Morning and Evening and other sundry Prayers

+ JMJ Along the theme of P^3 (Prayer, Penance, Patience), and for my own reference ... here is a collection of Morning and Evening prayers from the Ideal Daily Missal along with some additional prayers. In this crisis of the Church, I do not think it is possible to do too much prayer, penance and have patience. P^3

A Reply to Martin Blackshaw’s FLAWED Remnant article titled: FLAWED: SSPX Advice on Abortion-tainted Vaccines

+ JMJ An article has appeared in the Remnant (link to article) and I am afraid that there are a number of flaws in it that need to be addressed. The author, Martin Blackshaw, believes that both the Church and the SSPX are misapplying the principle of Moral Theology called 'Cooperation In Evil'. Unfortunately, Mr. Blackshaw rests most of his arguments on citing authors that support his position, without considering the possibility that they are wrong. This highlights a key factor in this crisis: ignorance of the faith and its application . I don't am not singling out Mr. Blackshaw for this criticism, I have observed that it applies to laity and religious, superior and subject a like. No one seems immune in this enduring crisis, myself included. I further believe that this ignorance is why so many Catholics, both traditional and non, rely on their gut feeling or "Catholic conscience" for charting their way through this crisis of the faith. While...

Magisterium and Levels of Assent

+ JMJ Understanding the levels of assent to be given to the teachings of the Church is a critical success factor in walking the knife's edge during this crisis of the Church. The levels of assent are generally associated with the theological grades of certainty, which are not surprisingly mirrored by the censures for contravening the teachings of the various levels.

Tradicat

Search This Blog