Skip to main content

Mary Victrix: The Cyrpto-Lefebvrist Dodge (aka The Crypto-Lefebvrist Dodge)

+
JMJ

Setting aside the spelling mistake in the title, I noticed yet another volley in the ongoing war of words between Fr. Greiger and various other people he has labelled as 'cyrpto-lefebvrists'.

I also noticed that he has made some statements that are not supported by references or distort the actual positions of the SSPX.

As a rule I assume that a person is of good-will and not of malicious intent.

This is, after all, the Catholic approach to relations.

So at this point I am assuming that Father Angelo Mary Greiger is simply operating under a confirmation bias, that he may be using to reduce any cognitive dissonance that he is experiencing.

As such when I noticed some of the issues with the post were incorrect, I emailed Fr. Greiger my thought.

As he has not amended the article, I post below a copy of my email.

P^3




Hi Father,
You failed to provide a reference for the following statement:
"... That intention, which he explicitly stated a number of times, was that the work of the Society should serve to weaken the influence of Vatican II.  ..." 
A reference would have been very supporting - especially if it was explicitly stated - as it would also seem to be inconsistent with the statement that the SSPX has the following approach to the council:

"...  This is quite along the lines of the distinctions made by Archbishop Lefebvre to read the Council in the light of Tradition:  what agrees with Tradition, we accept;  what is doubtful, we understand as Tradition has always taught it;  what is opposed, we reject. ..." ( http://www.dici.org/en/news/interview-with-bishop-bernard-fellay-on-relations-with-rome/ )
Likewise, the CNS interview is helpful:
"The pope says that ... the council must be put within the great tradition of the church, must be understood in accordance with it. These are statements we fully agree with, totally, absolutely," the bishop said. "The problem might be in the application, that is: is what happens really in coherence or in harmony with tradition?" ( http://www.catholicnews.com/data/stories/cns/1201931.htm )

Also, that the SSPX accepts, in this light, 95% of the Council. ( http://tradicat.blogspot.ca/2012/08/a-theologians-questions-john-rt-lamont.html )
Also you statement that the Hermeneutic of Continuity does not allow for "... debat[ing] the merits of the Council,..." seems inconsistent with the CNS report on the doctrinal preamble:

"... but the Vatican said it leaves room for "legitimate discussion" about "individual expressions or formulations present in the documents of the Second Vatican Council and the successive magisterium" of the church. ..."  (http://www.catholicnews.com/data/stories/cns/1202381.htm)

Perhaps I am operating under my own confirmation bias, but from my perspective you appear to have your own cultural blind spots.

At this point, I am assuming your good-will in this conflict of opinions and I am hoping you will provide corrections as noted above for those elements that contradict your statements.

Be assured of my prayers.

Cordially,

Tradical

Comments

Popular posts from this blog

Morning and Evening and other sundry Prayers

+ JMJ Along the theme of P^3 (Prayer, Penance, Patience), and for my own reference ... here is a collection of Morning and Evening prayers from the Ideal Daily Missal along with some additional prayers. In this crisis of the Church, I do not think it is possible to do too much prayer, penance and have patience. P^3

What the heck is a congregation of "Pontifical Right"

+ JMJ In a discussion with a friend the question occurred to me that I didn't actually know was is involved in being a religious order of 'pontifical right'. I had a vague notion that this meant they reported to Rome as opposed to the local diocese. I'm also aware that, according to the accounts I have heard, the Archbishop received 'praise' and the written direction to incardinate priests directly into the SSPX.  This is interesting because it implies that the SSPX priests were no longer required to incardinate in the local diocese but in the SSPX. This is something that belongs to an order of 'pontifical right'. Anyway here's some definitions: Di diritto pontificio is the Italian term for “of pontifical right” . It is given to the ecclesiastical institutions (the religious and secular institutes, societies of apostolic life) either created by the Holy See or approved by it with the formal decree, known by its Latin name, Decretu

Comparision of the Tridentine, Cranmer and Novus Ordo Masses

+ JMJ I downloaded the comparison that was linked in the previous article on the mass (here) . ... a very good reference! P^3 From: Whispers of Restoration (available at this link) . CHARTING LITURGICAL CHANGE Comparing the 1962 Ordinary of the Roman Mass to changes made during the Anglican Schism; Compared in turn to changes adopted in the creation of Pope Paul VI’s Mass in 1969 The chart on the reverse is a concise comparison of certain ritual differences between three historical rites for the celebration of the Catholic Mass Vetus Ordo: “Old Order,” the Roman Rite of Mass as contained in the 1962 Missal, often referred to as the “Traditional Latin Mass.”The Ordinary of this Mass is that of Pope St. Pius V (1570) following the Council of Trent (1545-63), hence the occasional moniker “Tridentine Mass.” However, Trent only consolidated and codified the Roman Rite already in use at that time; its essential form dates to Pope St. Gregory the Great (+604), in whose time the R

Is it sinful to attend the Novus Ordo (New Mass) - Is it Sinful to Not Attend the Novus Ordo on Sunday?

+ JMJ A non-SSPX Catholic is upset over the SSPX statements on not attending the Novus Ordo Missae. Ladies and gentlemen, what the SSPX, or at least its website editor, is advocating is a mortal sin against the Third Commandment.  Unless the priest deviates from the language of the Sacramentary, the consecration, and thus the rest of Mass is to be considered valid.  No one may elect not to attend Mass simply because abuses are occurring therein.  Might I suggest that such absenteeism is its own abuse?  The Third Commandment binds under mortal sin.  Father So-And-So from the SSPX has no authority whatsoever to excuse attendance at Mass, be that Mass ever so unpalatable. Source:Restore DC Catholicism Well, this is interesting. First why does the SSPX issue this statement? Because it is sinful to put your faith in danger by attending a protestant service.  It is likewise dangerous to put your faith in danger by attending a protestantized mass (ie the Novus Ordo Missae